Universal Access To All Knowledge
Home Donate | Store | Blog | FAQ | Jobs | Volunteer Positions | Contact | Bios | Forums | Projects | Terms, Privacy, & Copyright
Search: Advanced Search
Anonymous User (login or join us)
Upload

Reply to this post | Go Back
View Post [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 11, 2004 2:07am
Forum: etree Subject: Now available: File metadata entry interface

To all contributors:

You now have the ability to describe the files associated with your past uploads. You can now go through your old shows and enter information such as song titles. This information is used to draw the new interface we've created and as such you're highly encouraged to go through and enter the metadata. Also, unless you check "no lossy derivatives", this metadata is used in creating ID3 tags for Ogg and MP3 files. You can reach the interface by editing your show and then clicking "File options".

This interface will become available (and will be mandatory) for incoming shows in the very near future.

I'd appreciate feedback and bug reports.

Thanks!

This post was modified by Jonathan Aizen on 2004-02-11 10:07:08

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffbleblanc Date: Feb 14, 2004 12:41am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

One more comment. Sorry, I'm full of opinions lately Jon! :)

Right now, after the source/transfer info at the top of the details pages, the sections are arranged in this order:

1. File downloads
2. Setlist
3. Reviews
4. Notes

However, I think they would best be rearranged to this order:

1. Setlist
2. Notes
3. File Downloads
4. Reviews

This goes in line with a recent comment about the "Reviews" section being between the Setlist and Notes section. A good example is here:

http://www.archive.org/audio/etree-details-db.php?id=719

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffgreenone Date: Feb 11, 2004 6:14am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

Jon - just edited one of my shows and was surprised to see that we apparently have the ability to modify reviews, number of views and other information about shows that we have editing privileges for. Is this right?

Also, when I edited my show, I checked the "Do not make lossy copies" in addition to adding metadata, and suddenly the show is not available because it cannot be found. Any ideas? Hope I didn't break anything. :)

--Dave

ps. Show is here: http://www.archive.org/audio/etree-details-db.php?id=6633

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 11, 2004 6:16am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

You found a bug that I'm examining now (why the show isn't being found).

The ability to edit reviews and whatnot is unclear. Are you sure it lets you update that information?

Jon

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffgreenone Date: Feb 11, 2004 7:43am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

Thanks for the quick fix! It looks like it only *appears* to let you edit the reviews (you can put your cursor in the fields) but doesn't let you type in them. My bad, sorry for the false alarm on that count.

I do wonder about the "clean" button on the setlist field though - I'd never seen that before; what exactly is it supposed to do? When I tried it on that show in particular, it deleted everything except for (Nothing But) Flowers and the last three songs of the encore. Looks a bit strange that way so I didn't save changes but I'm curious what its function is.

Also, how *exactly* will the metadata be used if we don't specify lossy downloads? Is it just displayed on the main page or will it somehow be tagged on elsewhere? If I choose to put track numbers, song comments, etc., in the individual track names, is that ok, or will there eventually be some way of linking between or searching on tracks with the same name?

--Dave

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 11, 2004 7:53am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

doesn't let you type in them

Cool

I do wonder about the "clean" button on the setlist field though - I'd never seen that before; what exactly is it supposed to do?

It is supposed to take some standard setlist formats and clean them up. On some setlists it breaks, but on others it automatically does what normally has to be done manually (i.e. removes the notes, removes track times, etc.).

Also, how *exactly* will the metadata be used if we don't specify lossy downloads?

For the time being, the track titles will be shown on the details page so you can know which track you're downloading when you chose to download an individual track (instead of having to look at the setlist and map it in your head).

A feature I have in mind is to click on the name of a song and get lots of information about it (compression ratio, length in time, size, title, artist, show, etc.). Metadata is always good to keep around.

Eventually, it could even be mined. You could find out how many shows by band X have the song Y in them, or how many shows were shorter than 30 minutes.

If I choose to put track numbers, song comments, etc., in the individual track names, is that ok, or will there eventually be some way of linking between or searching on tracks with the same name?

PLEASE don't do that - it violates the integrity of the metadata. Once this stabilizes, I'll add the ability to add whatever fields you want right in the interface (so for instance you could add a "comments" field and put whatever you want in it).

Good questions!

--Dave

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffgreenone Date: Feb 11, 2004 10:52am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

For the time being, the track titles will be shown on the details page so you can know which track you're downloading when you chose to download an individual track (instead of having to look at the setlist and map it in your head).


Ok, great. Maybe that should be specified somewhere to have it do titles only to avoid having extraneous meta-data. How about encore (eg "E: I Spy") or segue notation ("I Spy>"), or should it be strictly song title?


A feature I have in mind is to click on the name of a song and get lots of information about it (compression ratio, length in time, size, title, artist, show, etc.). Metadata is always good to keep around.


Absolutely. How will this information be determined? Is it up to the uploader to provide it, or is there some way of calculating it automatically? If you're going to be mining this information, some pretty strict input standards will have to be rigged if it's user-enterable fields. Some great possibilities with that, though!

This post was modified by greenone on 2004-02-11 18:52:11

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffbleblanc Date: Feb 14, 2004 12:11am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

How about encore (eg "E: I Spy") or segue notation ("I Spy>"), or should it be strictly song title?

Hmmm... I really *want* to put these in there - it makes it sooo much easier to look at the download links and know exactly what I'm getting - but at the same time I can see the value in being able to run reports against shows down the road.

From what Jon says, I gather that having a song that has metadata title "E: I Spy" will not be included in a report run looking for song's titled "I Spy". Same goes for the segue's.

I guess it's a tossup. Which is more important, the accuracy of the download links or the ability to run accurate reports? My vote is for the accuracy of the download links (include the >'s and E:'s)

-Brad

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffbleblanc Date: Feb 14, 2004 12:51am
Forum: etree Subject: File metadata - minor Track Number bug??

Just filling these out for a few of the shows I uploaded. For every one of them, the system automatically fills in the fields called "Track Num:" for me - which is nice. However, in all 5 of the shows I've looked at, it fills it in correctly until the end of disc 2. For disc 3 it jumps back 5 or 6 numbers.

Jon? Here's an example, I didn't fill out anything for it so you can see it:

http://www.archive.org/audio/etree-details-db.php?id=2922

Just curious why it does that and if it can be fixed. Obviously minor, but figured I would point it out. Thanks.

-Brad

This post was modified by bleblanc on 2004-02-14 08:51:09

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 18, 2004 11:49pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: File metadata - minor Track Number bug??

This bug is now fixed

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 14, 2004 1:13am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: File metadata - minor Track Number bug??

Thanks - that's a bug. I'll look into it.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 14, 2004 1:13am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

Go either way, but do keep in mind that whatever you put in there will make it into the ID3 tags.

Jon

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffbleblanc Date: Feb 14, 2004 1:56am
Forum: etree Subject: Mining ID Tags?

In this case, I would definitely add them.

Another question Jon. On all of my latest seeds I have been filling out ID tags for the FLAC files. Here's an example:

http://www.archive.org/audio/etree-details-db.php?id=9155

I use FLAC Frontend to fill in all of the non-unique fields during the encoding process (Artist, Album, Year, Genre, Comment). Then, when it's done I use WinAmp to fill in the unique fields (Title, Track Number)

So, there's alot of info already embedded in the files in the format that I choose. Would it be possible to mine that data to automatically fill in the "File Options" fields? Or, if I fill out the "File Options" fields with different info will it overwrite the ID tags that the FLAC files were uploaded with?

Thanks.

-Brad

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 14, 2004 3:58am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Mining ID Tags?

Your originally uploaded files will never be overwritten!

I'm working on a way to read the information from the FLAC and MP3 ID3 tags to populate that form. The problem is that it takes time, yet people need to fill out the metadata for new shows when adding a new show (because they'll never come back to do it later). Anyway, it's on the table.

Jon

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 11, 2004 6:51am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

Okay, I found the bug and fixed it. Thanks for letting me know. Things should be better now.

Jon

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: datgeek Date: Feb 11, 2004 7:56am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

I am having problems, "some" of the shows I uploaded will let me edit them (Post Contribution center?) and some will not (Pre Contribution center?) any work around for this ?

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 11, 2004 8:00am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

I don't understand the problem. Can you please be more specific? What do you mean "let you edit them"?

This post was modified by Jonathan Aizen on 2004-02-11 16:00:09

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: datgeek Date: Feb 11, 2004 1:25pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

ok like
http://www.archive.org/audio/etree-details-db.php?id=464

this was one of the first shows I posted, and when I go to the page I do not get the option to "EDIT" as in fill in details, like taped by, set list etc that I get with a show that was uploaded later such as
http://www.archive.org/audio/etree-details-db.php?id=2131

does this clear it up a bit ?

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffJonathan Aizen Date: Feb 11, 2004 2:55pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: Now available: File metadata entry interface

Yes - those shows that you're talking about were added before the days of you importing your own stuff (when the admins used to do all the importing). Drop me an email (jon at archive dot org) reminding me and I'll be sure to "give you ownership" of those.

Thanks!

Jon

Terms of Use (10 Mar 2001)